By The Grace Of God
By admin on Sep. 6, 2005.
Mike McKenna did this interview for me also. By The Grace of God has gotten a bad reputation in some circles but I’ve always thought that first 7” they did on Victory totally raged. Plus it’s hard to deny a band that covers Bringin It Down and Plastic Bomb. This was done with Tommy, their drummer, sometime in 1998.
What’s going on in Louisville?
Right now Louisville is doing just fine. We are going through a stage right now where a lot of great new hardcore, punk, and indie rock bands are coming out of the woodwork. Some great new bands you should check out are:
Five Times Fast
Flight 19
The Aasee Lake
Automatic
Tri-tet
Half Seas Over
The Dangers
Espionage
…just to name a few. The only thing that kind of sucks right now is that there are barely any places that will hold all-ages shows. There is a place called Sparks where about 90% of the punk shows are. The club is really cool to us and the people who work there are very cooperative, but the room the bands play in sounds like crap. Rumor has it that some kids are trying to find a place to start a collective but I hear that like every six months and nothing ever happens. I hope it works out this time.
I noticed that By The Grace Of God changed their lineup recently. Who are the new members and have they played in other bands before?
Our two new members’ names are Robby Scott (who replaced Jay Palumbo on guitar) and Brian Roundtree aka “Tree” (who replaced Jon Mobly on bass). So far, everything is working out just great except that Tree tends to hang out with hippies in drum circles and ends up coming to practice all stoned and smelling like patchouli.
By The Grace of God started as an “all star” band of sorts. How exactly did it come about, and more specifically when did you become involved?
By The Grace of God started because Rob and Duncan missed being in a hardcore band together since the breaking up of the all-mighty Endpoint. Duncan went around Louisville and found the biggest straight edge losers he could and asked them to be in a band. So we had our first practice and wrote three songs (Goliath, Pallbearer’s Hymn, and Navigator) and played them over and over again, then a week later we played our first show on a whim with Earth Crisis. Shelter was supposed to play but their van broke down or something so we got up after the opening band and used their equipment and played our three songs and a Judge cover. The room went nuts. It was so fun and exciting but also very sloppy.
The Perspective album sounds more developed than the 7”. Is this because more time was spent in the studio, or was it because at that point By The Grace of God was a full-time band?
Well…neither. The songs on Perspective came out not as aggressive because that’s how they were written. We all didn’t sit down and say “hey, let’s write some more polished hardcore songs.” Hopefully, our next release will be much more aggressive the way I personally like it.
Some people would label By The Grace Of God as a political band. Obviously, there are some very political songs on your records but do you feel that this perception of the band in any way constrains you?
Not really. I am not really educated enough on politics to be as political as I want to be. When Rob writes his lyrics, he sometimes shares them with us so we can all put our ideas to mold it into a better song.
Are the messages reflected in such songs as November’s Lie and Red Hand Plan representative of the feelings of the band or are they mostly expressions of Rob’s ideas?
The songs November’s Lie and Red Hand Plan are expressions of Rob’s ideas.
Does By The Grace of God have any plans to head back into the studio in the near future?
By The Grace of God plans on going back in the studio in April to record songs for a new 7” on Three Little Girls Records out of Louisville, and some for some compilations.
Everyone knows By The Grace of God is on Victory. How did that come about? I mean, nothing against Victory, but why not go with Initial Records, who you not only work with, but is also a hometown label?
Just for the record, By The Grace of God is not on Victory anymore. We didn’t leave on bad terms. We still appreciate everything they did for us but in the long run Victory wasn’t the right label for us. Victory came into question about what labels we wanted to be on because Duncan’s old band Guilt was on Victory and Tony told Duncan that he wanted to put it out. We figured that Tony would probably get it out the fastest so we went with it. It worked out great because our record came out like a couple of months after we recorded it. The reason why we haven’t done anything with Initial is totally over my head. I wanted to release something with Initial from the get go, but it didn’t work out that way.
On the back of the Perspective LP there is a little box which says STRAIGHT EDGE IS A NON-VIOLENT MOVEMENT. I think that is really cool and more straight edge bands should promote non-violence. Do you think that violence in the straight edge community is as bad as everyone says it is?
I think it depends on what scene you are from. Here in Kentucky, we have a semi-violent scene but there are never any fights. The scene here is a lot different than say, New York or New Jersey because it seems that kids dance a whole lot more violent up there than they do in the south. I am strongly opposed to mindless violence and I think it has no place in any hardcore scene. If people have the brain to just talk things out instead of fighting, things wouldn’t be so bad in some scenes. I might get called a sissy for saying this but it’s just the logical thing to do…plain and simple.
What’s new with your other band, The Enkindels?
The Enkindels just finished the recording for our new LP Buzz Clip 2000. It is by far the best Enkindel release yet, much more melodic punk rock than emotional hardcore. We are going to be touring like hell this summer and hopefully go to Europe this winter. I love playing in all sorts of different genres of punk. I also play in a band called The Life Of An Ocean that’s different than anything else I’ve ever done.
What were the bands or albums which made you want to play hardcore?
There are tons and tons of records which made me want to play hardcore, but if I had to narrow it down to three records it would be Minor Threat-Out of Step, Gorilla Biscuits-Start Today, and Bad Religion-Suffer. But still today there are great records that are coming out that totally motivate me like Ten Yard Fight-Back On Track, and Good Riddance-Ballads From The Revolution.
Right now, in your opinion, what are the worst problems in the hardcore community?
Violence, sexism (yes, sexism…look around, it’s still there), and superiority.
What albums are you looking forward to in 1998?
I am looking forward to the new Ink and Dagger LP. I think Don and Sean are going to blow everyone’s ass apart with this next one. The Saves The Day LP. I am also looking forward to the next Boy Sets Fire release.
Any closing comments?
It seems like every five or six months I get a new record that totally blows me away. Recently I got the new Good Riddance LP and it is so fucking amazing. The music is incredible and the lyrics are ingenious. I can’t wait to see them live so I can run around and scream my head off. Check it out; if you don’t you are seriously missing out.
25 Ta Life
By admin on Jul. 28, 2005.
I did this interview with Rick Healey of the band 25 Ta Life via mail in June of 1996
What are the band members names?
Beto-Guitar
How long have you guys been together?
Rick-Vocals
Harry-Drums
Warren-Bass
Fred-Guitar
25 Ta Life first started in February of 1993 after I went on tour with Agnostic Front. I came back from the tour, Agnostic Front was breaking up, and I wanted to start a band similar to Agnostic Front; a band about the scene, about sticking together, to educate the kids, to motivate people, and get them active doing fanzines, helping each other out, sticking together, spreading flyers, etc. For awhile hardcore was in a pretty much sad state. There wasn’t that many bands in the early nineties. Hardcore got into the bigger clubs, a lot of the bigger labels took over. The scene fell apart, there’s no denying it. Without the kids there scene fell apart and that still holds true today. It’s all about the kids and all of our efforts to keep the scene strong. Once all the kids aren’t involved anymore, we leave it up to these people, the scene’s gonna die. That’s why 25 Ta Life, Commin Correct, Back Ta Basics, I totally support the whole DIY thing.
I have a side band now called Commin Correct. It’s a total DIY band. It will never be on a bigger label. It’s about staying true to the scene and keeping the scene strong. Any profits made go back into the scene, my label, making flyers; all the profits go into the scene. I urge people to do that and keep the scene alive. If we leave it to bigger labels, the scene is going to fall apart. They are only in it to make a profit from the hardcore scene.
Meanwhile, bands like 25 Ta Life and a lot of the new bands are doing it from the heart like Holdstrong from Massachusetts, Cornerstone from Connecticut, Hatebreed from Connecticut, Krutch from Pennsylvania. All these bands are doing it for the love of music. One King Down from Albany. All these kids do it from the heart for the love of music. One For One from New Jersey. They’re doing it for the love of music, that’s it.
25 Ta Life and Back To Basics definitely have a DIY attitude. Would you like to comment on that?
Well I pretty much just commented on that. To me, hardcore is my way of life. It’s things you believe in. For a long time ever since I first got into this music since I went to my first show at the end of 1985, 1986. I had all the records: Victim In Pain, Cause For Alarm, Cro-Mags, DRI, Corrosion of Conformity, stuff I listened to back then since then I was hooked. For awhile there it seemed like the scene fell apart but I still felt it in my heart. It had a tremendous effect on my life, like with drugs. For awhile now I’ve been straight, not that I am Straight Edge but this hardcore scene has guided me and helped me in my life to choose what I want to do and help me get a clear head so I’m able to do this nowadays and basically try to carry the scene and help other kids out and show them the way.
Ya know a lot of people think the scene is about them. But with 25 Ta Life, Back To Basics, Commin Correct, it’s about everybody. It’s about kids singing along. It’s about people getting involved, helping me distro my records. It’s about the family and meeting new people; that’s totally what I’m in this for. A lot of people want to bring up the past issues and things like that but I was younger then and even though I don’t feel bad for anything I did, ya know, bebecause you got to live life to learn about it, to know what it’s about. Make mistakes, not that everybody has to, but for me it was something I needed to do to find out. But I definitely choose a better path in life ya know? I’m definitely out to help people. It’s a good thing to be able to make a change and make yourself become a better person. Like I didn’t have to I could still be walking around like a tough guy, but I don’t care about that no more. It’s like nobody cares about that. You want to go through life and have a good time.
I heard that 25 Ta Life’s album is going to be on Victory. If so, how has your relationship been with them?
As far as the new record goes, we talked to Victory. I like Tony a lot, I respect his effort and what he does to keep the hardcore scene alive. I thought it would be a really good label to be on. I talked to Tony and he seemed really into it. There’s nothing definite, no contract signed. Even if the record doesn’t come out on Victory it won’t hurt 25 Ta Life. I just think Victory has a lot of bands right now and we wouldn’t be the main band that he focuses on. We might shop for something better. We are just going over contracts. But Victory is definitely a label we are considering being on. With Back Ta Basics, Tony carries all my stuff and I carry all the Victory stuff so we have a good relationship ya know? I support him and he supports everything I do.
Regardless, 25 Ta Life is going to have a new record out in early 1997 called Strength Through Unity: The Spirit Remains. Some of the new songs are gonna be Through These Eyes, Back Ta Basics, I Still Believe, and Turning Point. Back Ta Basics is about being involved and taking the scene back. Turning Point is about life, growing up, maturing, and pushing your life in a positive direction. I Still Believe is about how a lot of people bad mouth the scene, saying bands are trying to relive the past. I mean, whatever, it’s something that’s in my heart and I carry on. I still believe whether or not people believe in the message anymore of brotherhood, unity, and helping each other out. Fighting against that isn’t going to help. Help one another out and do the best you can do. Strive for world peace or just to make the world a better place and the hardcore scene a better place. To me it’s not about one band or one specific individual person. It’s for everyone, every kid, every band, every fanzine; there’s room for everybody. If you’re not wanted somewhere else, hardcore to me used to be when I was picked on by the jocks in school or the people who didn’t understand my look bebecause I was like a punk rock kid and earlier on I was into metal and stuff and people ya know looked at me weird or had something to say so I was like a kid who was always fighting for what I believed in and that’s totally what hardcore is. To me, the scene is about accepting and understanding each other. Everybody’s different, but that’s what we have in common and we should spread our message and what we believe. Just look out for each other and keep the scene strong.
What do you think of bands like Shelter, Focused, 108, etc who bring religion into hardcore?
When I was younger I didn’t believe in the whole religion thing, but as time went by in my life I’ve learned to accept other people and their opinions. Who am I to put them down and say that doesn’t belong. I’m not down with having any rules to follow but as far as a band like Shelter, I don’t know, maybe I’m just getting older, but I kinda respect those guys. You know people say their making money and why does he wear this, but you know they are a band with a good message and they’ve been doing it for and stuff and Ray Cappo you know they just do their thing. I totally respect those guys and 108. They are living a positive life so I really respect bands like that.
With 25 Ta Life a lot of people have their differences with us but I mean just accept people for who they are and if you don’t like it, that’s cool. That’s your opinion but respect people for what they do for the scene and for them being there and keeping the scene alive making fliers, etc. Just because I’m not a Krishna doesn’t mean I can’t be down with 108 or Shelter. I’ve played shows with both those bands. I think it’s totally cool. Respect, that’s the whole thing. Same with that big Earth Crisis show last week when they pulled the plug, they were throwing yogurt on the kid and the fighting with the kid who ran through the crowd with the fur coat on. That’s kinda disrespecting Earth Crisis. They are a band that sticks up for the animals, the weaker things in life who can’t defend themselves. I’m not with the whole militant thing, like if somebody is drinking knock the beer out of his hands, because that is there opinion. If I was still drinking beer and some kid tried to knock my beer out of my hands I’d knock his teeth out. I’m not gonna lie. That’s everyone’s individual right to drink a beer, not drink a beer, be vegan, not be vegan, be Krishna, not be Krishna; labels divide things. Respect brings it together regardless. Respect and looking out for each other that’s all I gotta say. Don’t talk shit about bands because what goes around comes around. If you talk shit be able to back up what you say. Don’t be on a computer saying shit where people can’t get to you. Bands who don’t want my help and wanna talk shit, I’m just not gonna play shows with your bands be because I don’t wanna be a part of that scene. I wanna be a part of a scene where people care about the music and are out to have a good time. The fight is against society, against those who put us down for our beliefs.
What do you think of the bands that played the Middlesex show?
Earth Crisis are amazing. I think they have a good message. They are really good guys. I totally support those guys. What happened at the Middlesex show was ridiculous.
Mouthpiece was always a band I really liked. Tim’s a good guy and I’ve always supported his band. They’ve been doing it for awhile so I totally support him.
Battery are really nice guys. Good band from DC.
All three bands are really good and that was a good show besides all the idiocy that happened. But what are you gonna do? Like I said, rise above the ignorance.
Any closing comments?
Thanks for your support Bill. I really appreciate you spreading the word for 25 Ta Life and giving me a chance to show what I’m about. Good with your zine! Peace, HARDCORE LIVES UNITY!
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Ensign
By admin on Jun. 26, 2005.
We did this interview at Princeton Arts Council in May of 1998. I believe this show was with Speak 714, Rain On The Parade, and Automatic. I can’t really tell you about what they are doing these days, but at the time we all really liked Ensign. A lot of my memories of that era have been soured over the years, but we used to have a lot of fun whenever Ensign played. Their first 7” has held up pretty well over the years.
Justin and I handled most of the questions. When I went to type this up I was pleasantly surprised by how Justin takes over for a good portion of the interview. There are also the usual patented silly questions from John and Justin, this time about the sexual orientation of characters on Scooby Doo. I had this strange fixation about the logo on The Direction Of Things To Come for some reason.
We also got some grief because of John’s comment about Jordan Cooper. Certain parties asked us to edit that out in future pressings (not Jordan; actually, I don’t think I’ve ever even spoken to him now that I think about it) and when we said “uh, no” those parties got really bummed. Oh well. All Ages had just came out and the asinine answers a lot of people give in that book really pissed us off. In the car on the way to the show I had been reading it and was really angry by the time we got to the show. This was the beginning of all three of us really souring on the youth crew and, in general, Straight Edge scene.
Anyhow, Tim Shaw handles this interview on Ensign’s end. This was day two of a big weekend of shows. I had just finished flunking out of my first year of college and to “celebrate” we hit up shows for the next three days. Friday evening was Breakdown/Fastbreak/In My Eyes/Floorpunch/Full Speed Ahead/Ensign. Saturday was Ensign/Automatic/Speak 714/Rain On The Parade and then Sunday was Ten Yard Fight/Speak 714/Fastbreak/Automatic. I busted my hand up really bad on Saturday I remember. Explaining that to my co-workers the next week was, as usual, rather aggravating. It’s pretty funny reading this back and remembering Victory’s brief flirtation with bands like Murphy’s Law and a time when Mackenzie was just the kid from Prospect who I never heard talk.
Bill-I guess we will start this out and ask who is in the band.
Tim-Me, my name is Tim, Nate on bass, Ryan on drums, and our newest member Mackenzie on guitar.
Justin-Tied Down
Bill-X Mob, man
Tim-Prospect…X Prospect X
Bill-Okay so I have three questions and then we can go from there…is Underdog really back together or were you just fucking with us?
Tim-It’s a rumor. I heard it from somebody at Revelation, but I don’t believe any of the rumors anymore. Ryan, if there is a chance a band might get back together, he won’t play the song which I kind of agree with; it’s kind of cheesy
Bill-When you mentioned it last night…people are already posting it on the internet….
Tim-I don’t know you can call Revelation because Ritchie works there, but to be on the safe side we stopped covering it
Bill-Into Another is broken up I think
Justin-Really? That sucks!
Tim-He is running art direction at Revelation
Bill-Okay, now for the internet question: Talk shit, Tim
Tim-I have very mixed feelings about the internet. I think it could be a very useful tool but there are too many little children who want to use it to talk shit and start fights. It is useless right now. The only thing I use it for is to email back and forth with people.
Bill-If it wasn’t for the internet I wouldn’t be doing the compilation I am doing with Craig from Talk Is Cheap Fanzine. I’ve met so many cool people, especially the Australian hardcore kids…they fucking rule, so that’s why I tried hooking you guys up to get you down there
Tim-For that stuff it’s awesome and I think you could go into a chat room and be like “here is the show, it starts at ____” but you get into the chat room and it’s “Tim Shaw was talking shit about this band” and then someone from the band logs on and is like “Yo we are going to show up at the show tonight and beat him up” it’s ridiculous. I don’t think half the shit talking that is said goes on really goes on, I don’t think the bands care that much. If that much shit talking went on in hardcore there would be fights at every show.
Bill-I get the feeling that when people talk shit about me that it’s the same kid over and over again. When I go to shows everybody is always cool but there is always those one or two who give you dumb looks, but I always have this feeling it’s the same few people. It’s not 50,000 people like it’s sometimes made out to be.
Tim-It’s somebody with a grudge. Like I said tonight, if I hear it I talk to the kid to his face because nine out of ten times they’ll deny it.
Bill-They never post under their real name
Tim-Oh no, never, it’s all a big game
Justin-It’s good in theory
Tim-Yeah I think it has good applications but it can’t be used right now
Bill-Jeff Perlin used to post on the Rev Board until a week ago when all these assholes were posting racist shit. I mean, they are probably “joking” or whatever, but Jeff was like, yo, that’s fucked up!
* Various muttering about Breakdown ruling *
Bill-Okay so my third question-What’s up with Ensign stealing the Mariner’s logo?
Tim-Not intentionally.
Bill-Okay. When the record came out I was like “what the fuck?”
Justin-I just thought it looked really glossy
Bill-(still harping on this like it was an important issue) Did Ryan pick it because he is from Seattle?
Tim-Dave Mandel came up with it
Justin-It looks really slick
Bill-Baseballcore
Tim-Yeah that’s gonna be the new thing in hardcore. We took it because it was a compass with the whole direction…
Justin-Do you think Freddie from Scooby Doo is gay?
Tim-I’m not stereotyping people, but I don’t see many people wearing assocs. But, then again, it was the sixties.
Justin-Doesn’t Austin Powers wear one? He is pretty hetro.
Tim-Maybe he is…but then you could say the girl with the glasses would be a lesbian.
Justin-Emo chick
Tim-He was a free spirit
Justin-But he always ended up with the girl
Tim-Yeah he always ended up alone with the girl. He might have been a real femme guy who gets tons of girls
Bill-He could have been a model when he wasn’t solving capers
Justin-Do you think that bands that get back together push the attention away from the good things we have now?
Tim-There is one band in particular, I’m not gonna talk shit, but they come back with ex-members and their first show they are headlining over Floorpunch, over Ensign, over In My Eyes…bands that work really hard in 1998 to be an active part of the hardcore scene.
Justin-I thought Speak 714 was cool because they didn’t headline.
Tim-Yeah when Speak 714 booked their tour they said they didn’t want to headline which is cool. Like certain bands get back together and…
Bill-I’ll talk shit: Better Than A Thousand. They played their first show and headlined.
Tim-I know there is a lot of bands out there that work hard and because Mark Porter isn’t a scene star, Ronny Little, Tim Shaw…the band with the scene star is the band everyone is going to be there to see. It sucks because bands work really hard.
Justin-It’s a given when you have Civ or Ray or someone like that people are going to be psyched.
Tim-I know Ray and Civ have paid their dues but when you start over you gotta start at the bottom.
Bill-It’s a new beginning. A good example of that is Mouthpiece and Hands Tied. Mouthpiece headlined shows and now Hands Tied started from the bottom and is working their way up.
Justin-If Underdog does get back together people will say “oh wow, Ensign is playing!” but in the back of their minds…
Bill-Like the Cro Mags show
Justin-But that’s the Cro Mags!
Tim-Yeah, that’s the Cro Mags. I think the difference is when some former straight edge all star comes back and everyone is like “oh my god, it’s Ray/Dan O or whatever I think there is a big difference between that and the Cro Mags or Breakdown getting back together. It would be cool if say…Lou Kollar had a side band but when it is someone who hasn’t had anything to do with the scene for years they are like “oh wow hardcore is pretty popular now.”
Bill-Bold.
Tim-Yeah, Matt, Ray, what about the bands that are here today?
Bill-How about bands that have always been here like Murphy’s Law?
Justin-Hogan’s Heroes, they’ve been around and now they are on Victory….
Bill-What do you think of the new “old school” Victory Records?
Tim-I think Tony needed some bands. I’m not Victory’s biggest fan, I make no bones about it. Strife are friends of mine but they’re broken up now. Snapcase are friends of mine but I don’t think they are on the label anymore. I think the Hatebreed record is really awesome. You can’t really say anything bad about Tony, he’s just trying to get bands to keep his label alive. They asked us but we turned it down. Too much politics, too much stuff, goes along with it.
Bill-I think, and it goes the same with Equal Vision and Revelation, they go in these cycles of whatever is cool. Victory went from Even Score and Inner Strength and all these horrible bands or even worse stuff like Earth Crisis. It’s just weird they went from Firestorm to signing Murphy’s Law.
Tim-Tony is a businessman, he is just looking out.
John-Jordan Cooper is an asshole.
Bill-I read All Ages in the van today and I was really bummed out by some of the things he said.
Tim-Well he’s done a lot for hardcore. There were a few years there where I thought Revelation was the worst label on the earth. Now I can’t say that because they have In My Eyes. Now we are kind of connected to Indecision which is an exclusive part of Revelation. We might as well be on Revelation. I’m all for labels getting bands, but there was a period of time when the Victory empire…if you weren’t a Victory band no one gave a shit. That’s fucking ridiculous.
Justin-Colored vinyl pisses me off.
Tim-I collect but I’m not obsessive about it. But Ensign is all guilty as anyone else because we did limited presses for Europe. I do it because I think “wow, that’s a cool idea.” If I can get it, I get it, If I can’t, I can’t. You know what though, if you really listen to your records, colored vinyl does not sound as good. It’s a technical fact. My Floorpunch on Gold, it’s unlistenable, but my black one is.
Bill-Well if it’s a remastered you should buy it on CD; Mickey and I were just talking about that.
Tim-I love to collect records but I don’t live a lifestyle where I can shell out $150 for a four song seven inch.
Bill-Have you ever seen that auction Revelation does?
Tim-Yeah, it’s sick.
Bill-I went on there a couple days ago; the first press for Speak Out with no matrix, the gate fold cover, and all that stuff went for $270. That was the first bid, it’s not even like it went up!
Justin-The thing that gets me is sometimes getting the record means more than listening to the record.
Bill-The kids on the trade board just post all their cool records for scene points.
*At this point we bullshit about various New Jersey bands. For some reason I never transcribed this stuff. Somehow we segway into discussing European youth crew kids. *
Bill-European hardcore kids seem to be really obsessed with, well, New Jersey hardcore. They find out you are from New Jersey and you get put up on a pedestal. I guess because Floorpunch, or Ensign, or whoever isn’t there everyday they get so hyped up.
Justin-We take it for granted so much.
John-We do the same with a band like Underdog or Antidote who we haven’t seen.
Tim-Going over there I don’t think there was really a lot of hero worship. As soon as we were done everyone would be upfront asking questions and hanging out. When we finished, if we didn’t play long enough, you fucking bet we heard about it. Every so often a kid will relate me to Sick Of It All, but I’m not Lou or Pete, so…For awhile we played every weekend in New Jersey but after awhile you get sick of us.
Bill-I’m ready for another set right now. Are there still a lot of nazi skinheads in Germany?
Tim-They don’t go to shows over there; it’s always been very political here they came to hardcore shows, got the shit beat out of them and never came back. In Europe it’s purely political.
Justin-Doesn’t it suck now that when Sick Of It All plays they don’t play many old songs?
Tim-They play old songs!? They’ve got so many records now. There isn’t a Sick Of It All record I don’t like.
Justin-(Clearly not convinced) Yeah, I guess…
*At this point we get interrupted a few times by various people. I think the show was wrapping up and they were really trying to get people out of the place.*
Justin-Is there any particular person that song Hold is about?
Tim-Just a general thing. Nate actually wrote the lyrics and I had a long discussion with him about it. When someone else in the band write lyrics I have to sit down and talk to them to see if it is something that I agree with. There is an aspect of that, it’s supposed to be a positive thing to that, says there is always going to be people who walk away, but there is always going to be people who stick with you. It’s a fact of life, it’s not even just a hardcore thing.
Bill-Okay I think we need to shut up now.
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